CERN, the European particle-physics collaboration which operates the Large Hadron Collider, will expel hundreds of Russian-affiliated scientists from its laboratories.
The Geneva-based organization decided to cut ties with Moscow after Russia’s 2022 invasion of Ukraine, ending nearly 60 years of collaboration, and the agreements are now lapsing. Russia has never been a full member but worked closely on nuclear physics.
Scientists tied to Belarusian institutions already saw their contracts end in July, and any Russian-linked scientists will lose access, as well as residency permits, in December.
CERN will, however, maintain links with the Joint Institute for Nuclear Research, an intergovernmental center near Moscow, a decision which is controversial with some researchers.
Why it hasn’t happened already? Like, maybe in 2014 or in 2022?
What took ao long?
science and politics, mix well together. shake before using
The organisation is one step of us again!
North Korea hires Russian scientists. I’m sure they’ll be fine.
There will be a few working for the Russian Government’s “security organs’, but most will be there to advance humanity’s understanding of fundamental natural processes.
It’s a crying shame that – once again – the usual 5 per cent of any human group that are basically self serving and dishonest towards their peers is potentially causing years of delay to vitally important work. The same 5 per cent that created the need for door locks, police and prisons. It’s also a shame that the decent ones haven’t already outted the snakes, who will be well known to them.
They not letting them to renew the contracts
So I actually used to work with a lot Russians at CERN. Most were pretty chill. Many were heavy drinkers, dear god the number of nights that blurred into obscurity where Id wake up hungover at my desk because when a liquor bottle is opened you don’t stop until it’s empty. The younger group was pretty insular and mostly stuck to themselves but the older folks were interesting to talk with.
It sucks because most of them were just there for the science like the rest of us, but I’m also glad I’m not in that world anymore because I grew up in an area with a huge Ukrainian immigrant population and would have an exceedingly short fuse if I heard any of them spout anti-Ukrainian sentiments.
It’s easy to mash a bunch of cultures together when there’s no wars going on.
Sad for the ones that were just trying to advance science, can’t imagine that they were all evil.
I feel bad for Russian’s who are politically powerless, hate what their government is doing in their name, and have no ability to create meaningful change in their society.
With strict vetting of course, there should be a way to rescind your citizenship if your country of origin is commiting genocide and war crimes and become a political refugee.
While I see the necessity here, it’s a sad state of affairs that your country of origin can exclude you from contributing toward the advancement of human knowledge because of one megalomaniacal historical revisionist with a god complex and nothing but cold indifference toward the lives of his own people.
Yes let’s make science’s progress suffer! /s
What about their research projects? Their 4y long PhD or Post -doc? People read nuclear and think they were creating an atomic bomb or secret weapons because of movies.. This article needs more details on who exactly are they sending away.
If it’s just scientists directly in a ‘government team’ that uses the lab then it’s understandable
Is it because of the war or something else?
If the war, why now.
All in all, sad situation.
yeah, THAT will show Putin what’s what.
Do you think this will have a big impact on scientific collaboration or is it more of a symbolic political gesture?
I feel like the short story that Semafor posted leaves out a lot of details and makes it look much more grave that what is mentioned in the longer [Nature post](https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-024-02982-6) which is linked in the article.
First of all the nature article says that about 90 scientist, who are affiliated with Russian institutions, are concerned. Furthermore, it also mentions that the majority have moved from Russian institutions to non-Russian institutions so they’ll keep their positions. They had two years to make this switch. It’s not like CERN is abruptly kicking out all its Russian scientists.
Really sucks their government is so ridiculously fucked. Russian contributions to nuclear physics have been massive.
What a brilliant, well-thought move. /s
Russia: commits itself to a war footing against Europe. Threatens nuclear strikes. Commits acts of war against European cou tries
Also Russia: you westerners are all russophobic nazi pidarasi
I don’t support this. Discriminating scientists because of government actions isn’t pure. I believe scientists have an emotional attachment to what they do, especially after dedicating decades of their lives to research.
But there’s also a universe where they *didn’t* expel hundreds of Russian-affiliated scientists from their laboratories.
Weird precedent to set. Will they expel all scientists from nations at war or committing crimes going forward? Like, will they expel all Iranian scientists because of Iran’s support of various terrorist organizations? What about Chinese scientists, with China’s ongoing genocide of the Uyghur people?
I would think that one major takeaway from the cold war is that academic boycotts harm everyone. It’s one thing if knowledge is being used to create weapons, it’s a whole other matter if it’s research for its own sake.
Sad day for Science.
Funny how politics can harm the progress of science.
El Psy Congroo.
You love to see it.
I have worked with Russian physicists at CERN. Brilliant and tough folks. I’d argue that having them at CERN measuring the mass of the W boson or probing quark-gluon plasma is better than letting them work for their own government.
Why not years ago already???
It’s a shame how many lives one man can ruin in a life time.
30 comments
**From the [Semafor Flagship](https://www.semafor.com/newsletter/09/19/2024/semafor-flagship-a-geometric-patterned-holy-grail?utm_campaign=semaforreddit) newsletter:**
CERN, the European particle-physics collaboration which operates the Large Hadron Collider, will expel hundreds of Russian-affiliated scientists from its laboratories.
The Geneva-based organization decided to cut ties with Moscow after Russia’s 2022 invasion of Ukraine, ending nearly 60 years of collaboration, and the agreements are now lapsing. Russia has never been a full member but worked closely on nuclear physics.
Scientists tied to Belarusian institutions already saw their contracts end in July, and any Russian-linked scientists will lose access, as well as residency permits, in December.
CERN will, however, maintain links with the Joint Institute for Nuclear Research, an intergovernmental center near Moscow, a decision which is controversial with some researchers.
[Read the full story here](https://www.semafor.com/article/09/19/2024/cern-to-expel-hundreds-of-russian-scientists?utm_campaign=semaforreddit).
Why it hasn’t happened already? Like, maybe in 2014 or in 2022?
What took ao long?
science and politics, mix well together. shake before using
The organisation is one step of us again!
North Korea hires Russian scientists. I’m sure they’ll be fine.
There will be a few working for the Russian Government’s “security organs’, but most will be there to advance humanity’s understanding of fundamental natural processes.
It’s a crying shame that – once again – the usual 5 per cent of any human group that are basically self serving and dishonest towards their peers is potentially causing years of delay to vitally important work. The same 5 per cent that created the need for door locks, police and prisons. It’s also a shame that the decent ones haven’t already outted the snakes, who will be well known to them.
They not letting them to renew the contracts
So I actually used to work with a lot Russians at CERN. Most were pretty chill. Many were heavy drinkers, dear god the number of nights that blurred into obscurity where Id wake up hungover at my desk because when a liquor bottle is opened you don’t stop until it’s empty. The younger group was pretty insular and mostly stuck to themselves but the older folks were interesting to talk with.
It sucks because most of them were just there for the science like the rest of us, but I’m also glad I’m not in that world anymore because I grew up in an area with a huge Ukrainian immigrant population and would have an exceedingly short fuse if I heard any of them spout anti-Ukrainian sentiments.
It’s easy to mash a bunch of cultures together when there’s no wars going on.
Sad for the ones that were just trying to advance science, can’t imagine that they were all evil.
I feel bad for Russian’s who are politically powerless, hate what their government is doing in their name, and have no ability to create meaningful change in their society.
With strict vetting of course, there should be a way to rescind your citizenship if your country of origin is commiting genocide and war crimes and become a political refugee.
While I see the necessity here, it’s a sad state of affairs that your country of origin can exclude you from contributing toward the advancement of human knowledge because of one megalomaniacal historical revisionist with a god complex and nothing but cold indifference toward the lives of his own people.
Yes let’s make science’s progress suffer! /s
What about their research projects? Their 4y long PhD or Post -doc?
People read nuclear and think they were creating an atomic bomb or secret weapons because of movies.. This article needs more details on who exactly are they sending away.
If it’s just scientists directly in a ‘government team’ that uses the lab then it’s understandable
Is it because of the war or something else?
If the war, why now.
All in all, sad situation.
yeah, THAT will show Putin what’s what.
Do you think this will have a big impact on scientific collaboration or is it more of a symbolic political gesture?
I feel like the short story that Semafor posted leaves out a lot of details and makes it look much more grave that what is mentioned in the longer [Nature post](https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-024-02982-6) which is linked in the article.
First of all the nature article says that about 90 scientist, who are affiliated with Russian institutions, are concerned. Furthermore, it also mentions that the majority have moved from Russian institutions to non-Russian institutions so they’ll keep their positions. They had two years to make this switch. It’s not like CERN is abruptly kicking out all its Russian scientists.
Really sucks their government is so ridiculously fucked. Russian contributions to nuclear physics have been massive.
What a brilliant, well-thought move. /s
Russia: commits itself to a war footing against Europe. Threatens nuclear strikes. Commits acts of war against European cou tries
Also Russia: you westerners are all russophobic nazi pidarasi
I don’t support this. Discriminating scientists because of government actions isn’t pure. I believe scientists have an emotional attachment to what they do, especially after dedicating decades of their lives to research.
But there’s also a universe where they *didn’t* expel hundreds of Russian-affiliated scientists from their laboratories.
Weird precedent to set. Will they expel all scientists from nations at war or committing crimes going forward? Like, will they expel all Iranian scientists because of Iran’s support of various terrorist organizations? What about Chinese scientists, with China’s ongoing genocide of the Uyghur people?
I would think that one major takeaway from the cold war is that academic boycotts harm everyone. It’s one thing if knowledge is being used to create weapons, it’s a whole other matter if it’s research for its own sake.
Sad day for Science.
Funny how politics can harm the progress of science.
El Psy Congroo.
You love to see it.
I have worked with Russian physicists at CERN. Brilliant and tough folks. I’d argue that having them at CERN measuring the mass of the W boson or probing quark-gluon plasma is better than letting them work for their own government.
Why not years ago already???
It’s a shame how many lives one man can ruin in a life time.
Good. Fuck Russia.